| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51] > | New at ProZ.com: Outsourcer "willingness to work again" feedback for translators Thread poster: Enrique Cavalitto
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pascie 
Local time: 06:02
English to French
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| I might have missed something | Jun 29, 2006 |
Henry,
Collecting and gathering information need to be handled according to the highest level of security, confidentiality requirements.
Another question arose as I was reading this thread.
Why do you need/are willing to be such in the middle of things? In other words, so involved.
Don't you think it's already over the edge to offer your services as a consultant when jobs are posted in order to help the outsourcer to find the translators accordingly?
Which qualifica... See more Henry,
Collecting and gathering information need to be handled according to the highest level of security, confidentiality requirements.
Another question arose as I was reading this thread.
Why do you need/are willing to be such in the middle of things? In other words, so involved.
Don't you think it's already over the edge to offer your services as a consultant when jobs are posted in order to help the outsourcer to find the translators accordingly?
Which qualifications have you in this field, besides recommending some of your 'protégés'?
All of these actions taken or on the way to be taken are to me only perception-based. This is not within the goal/mission of supporting objectively the translator community. ▲ Collapse
| | | | pascie
Local time: 06:02
English to French
+ ...
Since I am waiting for a project to be delivered, Ihave then time to take part in the community.
Still ATTN: Henry.
I have another question.
For the same reasons above mentioned, I took some time to review my profile.
I was very surprised to see that Wordfast was mentioned as CAT Tool in my profile.
Who gave you this information, where did you collect it from?
Why do you still link me to Transpose.info, LLC, especially the link to the Blueboard, though on my p... See more Since I am waiting for a project to be delivered, Ihave then time to take part in the community.
Still ATTN: Henry.
I have another question.
For the same reasons above mentioned, I took some time to review my profile.
I was very surprised to see that Wordfast was mentioned as CAT Tool in my profile.
Who gave you this information, where did you collect it from?
Why do you still link me to Transpose.info, LLC, especially the link to the Blueboard, though on my profile 'member since February 2006' displays.
It's more than a singular discrepancy.
By the way, the link to the blueboard should be completely deleted. The lack of accurate information still remains. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | This is getting repetitive but... | Jun 29, 2006 |
Henry wrote: Lesley Clarke wrote:
I absolutely do not understand why Proz should collect data on me that only I would see. My clients are perfectly capable of communicating with me directly. Thanks, you're number 14. Can you help me out by explaining exactly why you require the ability to prevent people from entering feedback that only you would see? Sorry to be repetitive (and probably annoying), folks, but I am trying to get a handle on this, trying to reach a solution, and it will help to know not only your request, but also your reasoning!
Henry, I love Proz, I think you are brilliant and I depend more on it than you could imagine. But I don't understand your not understanding. I am particularly paranoid about the feedback column because of my experience with an agency that not only got away not paying my 4,800 dollars (and that was at an extremly low rate of pay) but managed to block my negative score on the Blueboard. This woman is a lawyer and nasty, she would probably be glad of the change to do me even more harm and she seems to know how to work the system.
But if I don't want to show feedback, why on earth do you want to collect feedback on me? It is just not logical. Do we all have to withdraw from Proz for you to understand.
I could also repeat many of the arguments that other people have put much bette than I ever could and that I subscribe to.
| | | | Susana Galilea
United States
Local time: 05:02
English to Spanish
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Just for the record
That stated, I stand by the rest of my comments. And I would ask you Henry, if I may, to put yourself in our shoes for a second. You are a capable business person, as we all are or strive to be: how would you react if a salesperson tried to sell you a product that not only has no value to you, but in your personal assessment (call it professional instinct, no need to explain it to anyone else) is... See more Just for the record
That stated, I stand by the rest of my comments. And I would ask you Henry, if I may, to put yourself in our shoes for a second. You are a capable business person, as we all are or strive to be: how would you react if a salesperson tried to sell you a product that not only has no value to you, but in your personal assessment (call it professional instinct, no need to explain it to anyone else) is distasteful and could potentially (no matter how remote the chances) harm your business. And then kept insisting on hearing your reasoning, ad nauseam, as to why you wouldn't just agree to the transaction already. This is how this situation is going down in my view. And from many of my colleague's comments I know I am not alone. The irony is not lost on me that you keep insisting a community of communications professionals is not being eloquent enough.
And with this, I wish you all pleasant dreams/breakfast/etc.
Susana
[Edited at 2006-06-29 02:28] ▲ Collapse
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Dyran Altenburg (X)
United States
Local time: 06:02
English to Spanish
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| Jedi Mind Trick Anyone? | Jun 29, 2006 |
And while we're here scratching our heads wondering what the *bleep* is going on, the feedback thingie is back on the profiles.
I mean, really...
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Dyran
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Dyran Altenburg wrote:
And while we're here scratching our heads wondering what the *bleep* is going on, the feedback thingie is back on the profiles.
I mean, really...
--
Dyran
And it is still there even after you choose the "opt out" box (just for good measure, as it states users are opted-out by default).
Huh. Imagine that.
| | | | | Checking back in... and out... | Jun 29, 2006 |
Just had time to check back in and get caught up. Many thanks to those who cooperated by clarifying their reasoning. The exercise was useful, and I can explain why tomorrow. I'll also explain why offering an out/out option has its issues.
In the meantime, I would consider it kind if those of you who have speculated on some sort of ulterior motive would simply withhold judgment.
Thanks.
To Dyran: I just checked and as far as I can tell, nothing changed with ... See more Just had time to check back in and get caught up. Many thanks to those who cooperated by clarifying their reasoning. The exercise was useful, and I can explain why tomorrow. I'll also explain why offering an out/out option has its issues.
In the meantime, I would consider it kind if those of you who have speculated on some sort of ulterior motive would simply withhold judgment.
Thanks.
To Dyran: I just checked and as far as I can tell, nothing changed with profiles. So I don't know what you are referring to with the "jedi mind trick" comment. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | What is there? | Jun 29, 2006 |
Terry Thatcher Waltz, Ph.D. wrote: Dyran Altenburg wrote:
And while we're here scratching our heads wondering what the *bleep* is going on, the feedback thingie is back on the profiles.
I mean, really...
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Dyran And it is still there even after you choose the "opt out" box (just for good measure, as it states users are opted-out by default). Huh. Imagine that.
Alright, help me out... what exactly do you see? I have logged in as you and see only the option to turn feedback on and off. Can't very well do away with that, folks, if choice is what you want... plus it has been there ever since we removed feedback from the profiles by default.
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| Only on the owner's view. | Jun 29, 2006 |
Henry wrote: Terry Thatcher Waltz, Ph.D. wrote: Dyran Altenburg wrote:
And while we're here scratching our heads wondering what the *bleep* is going on, the feedback thingie is back on the profiles.
I mean, really...
--
Dyran And it is still there even after you choose the "opt out" box (just for good measure, as it states users are opted-out by default). Huh. Imagine that. Alright, help me out... what exactly do you see?
where it is needed. It is not on the visitor's view. I checked on Terry's and Dyran's profile, as a visitor, of course. It is not there, but it is in my owner's profile and not when I forced the visitor's view.
| | | | sarahl (X)
Local time: 03:02
English to French
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Susana Galilea wrote:
The irony is not lost on me that you keep insisting a community of communications professionals is not being eloquent enough.
Susana
[Edited at 2006-06-29 02:28]
Thanks for pointing this out. A number of communications pros have expressed the same idea, yet we don't seem to get through to Henry.
I am through here, good night everyone.
[Edited at 2006-06-29 03:30]
| | | | | Please don't put words in my mouth, Susana | Jun 29, 2006 |
sarahl wrote: Susana Galilea wrote:
The irony is not lost on me that you keep insisting a community of communications professionals is not being eloquent enough. Thanks for pointing this out. A number of communications pros have expressed the same idea, yet we don't seem to get through to Henry.
I never said anything like that, Susana. I pressed to get each person's reasons, as a kind of survey. It was not that I understood no one's responses.
Sorry to take issue with your misquote, but I hope you can appreciate that when I get misquoted, it often travels.
| | | | Susana Galilea
United States
Local time: 05:02
English to Spanish
+ ...
| not my intention, Henry | Jun 29, 2006 |
Henry wrote:
Sorry to take issue with your misquote, but I hope you can appreciate that when I get misquoted, it often travels.
It was not my intention to misquote you, or quote you at all for that matter. I do offer my sincere apologies if this is what came through in my comment. My experience of the back and forth that took place earlier today left me (and others have expressed the same) with the distinct and puzzling feeling we were not getting through to you--hopefully this is a more suitable way to express it.
Good night everyone, for real this time
Susana
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[quote]Henry wrote:
A good number of those posting (71 people in all) are in the out/out camp. Among them are at least Terry, Stefane, Luis, MichaelRS, Dominique, Heike, Larissa, Dyran, Cristobal, Giovanni, Maya and JLBaker (this list is roughly in the order you have joined this thread).
I consider you twelve the representatives of the out/out camp, which is undoubtedly much larger than twelve. By participating in this thread, you speak on behalf of a much larger group. Thank you for your hard work in hanging in this thread this long, for reading this far, and for your interest in making sure ProZ.com is everything it should be.
As you can see, I thought initially that the option to show or not show WWA entries would be enough to satisfy the community's needs. Clearly, I was wrong. It is now evident that an adjustment must be made to this system to maintain the harmony in our community.
In the interest of making the proper adjustments, I would like to better understand your need to opt out/out. I hope you will assist in this respect.
I have gone through all the posts from you, the out/out team, and these are these reasons I see so far:
1. You are concerned about privacy / security / libel.
2. You do not want your relationship with you clients to be affected in any way by a new ProZ.com feature.
I consider these two arguments valid. What I would like to know is, are these the main reasons? Are there other specific reasons why you need to be able to prevent others from making WWA entries that only you should see?
Or, is it not so much either of the above, but rather an issue of principles? Do you simply not buy into the WWA approach? Or is it simply that you don't want to be bothered with unsolicitied feedback?
****I screwed up the quotes! Here's the page break*****
Hi Henry- just got up, sorry so late in getting back to your questions. I have a huge workload today, so I need to be super quick...
Your two statements above are correct in my case. But for me, personally, I do not want ProZ, or anyone else for that matter, to act as any kind of go-between for me and my clients. I work alone and take responsibility for my own business. That's one of the reasons that I love this job! And any "feedback", whether it is positive or not, I want to be directed directly to my mailbox, telephone or face. That way I can answer for it, dispute it, bask in the glory, or whatever, PRIVATELY. I find that ProZ is a great tool for my work, but it is just that, a tool. It's not my agent! I'm my agent. I want to put what I want in my profile as I do in my CV. (which you have again permited me to do- thank you) As I stated in my former post, my work should speak for itself. And if an outsourcer has something to say to me, by all means they can contact me personally...
In a nutshell, I want direct confrontation and communication with the people I work with. I DO NOT want any entities in the middle. Period.
Hope I've been clear. I can't really support my "feelings" on the matter except to say my business is just that- my business.
Thanks for asking for my opinion!
Off to work-
Jennifer
[Edited at 2006-06-29 08:44]
| | | | | That's exactly my feeling | Jun 29, 2006 |
Henry wrote:
[May I conclude that your desire to opt out of receiving WWA entries, like Marc Prior's and Dyran's, is based primarily on my prior point 2, ie. "You do not want your relationship with you clients to be affected in any way by a new ProZ.com feature"?
You didn't count me in, either, although I have been here with several posts starting from page 2 and I have never changed my mind....
The data collecting aspect brought up by Terry if I'm not wrong is another very serious concern.
| | | | | Quote dating back to page 19 already... | Jun 29, 2006 |
(There have been similar issues since then but this one hit me.)
MichaelRS wrote:
What bothered me was not this issue per se, but the feeling that he is starting to cross a line here to go on a new data-collection adventure.
I have to say that before this feature was introduced, I was almost astounded at how amicable Henry seemed with regard to issues on the board. I'm not saying that sarcastically - I thought he really listened to what people were saying and tried to adjust the board for even petty matters - far more than you usually run across in life.
But I get the feeling that there may be marketing ideas at work here (people will have to nag their clients to come on this board to give them a good review) or other things that are not being clearly brought out. The feeling is: The translators are going to like it, and I'm going to make them like it somehow.
We are asked to repeat what we already stated, more or less concisely (several of us more than once) 10, 15 or 20 pages ago, and are now making hair-splitting. We are moving in a circle...
But we still don't know more about the reasons: why Henry is so unusually determined in this case (other than having invested a lot of work and efforts, of course)?
Puzzling....
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