| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Translating a book already translated Thread poster: mekman99
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My question is:
An editor asked me to translate a book into French. He gave me three different translations of the same book and asked me to translate the book with the help of these translations. He told me that the aim is to improve these translations. So to what extent can I use these translations?
| | | | Paulinho Fonseca 
Brazil
Local time: 20:53
Member (2011)
English to Portuguese
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| Translation based on my experience and knowledge | Nov 17, 2016 |
Translation based on my experience and knowledge
If client asks me to review a previous translated doc, then I agree. However, I would not translate a document based on another previous translation for the same doc, unless there is new and significant content. I would talk to client and rather translate it from scrap and explain there are a number of issues related to translation which might represent localization from one region/country to another, etc., as well as quality that become an ... See more Translation based on my experience and knowledge
If client asks me to review a previous translated doc, then I agree. However, I would not translate a document based on another previous translation for the same doc, unless there is new and significant content. I would talk to client and rather translate it from scrap and explain there are a number of issues related to translation which might represent localization from one region/country to another, etc., as well as quality that become an issue.
Good luck. ▲ Collapse
| | | | rrabago
Mexico
Local time: 17:53
English to Spanish
| re: Translating a book already translated | Nov 17, 2016 |
The previous versions might help you to get a better context, but I'd yrather to start from scratch with your own style..
regards..RR
| | | | Tina Vonhof (X)
Canada
Local time: 17:53
Dutch to English
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| One way to approach it | Nov 17, 2016 |
You could read the existing translations to see what you like or dislike about each one. I mean not necessarily about specific passages (although you could jot down a few examples) but more your overall impression and opinion of what is good or bad about each book as a whole. Paulinho's suggestion about localization is useful to consider as well. Then start from scratch with a firm idea in mind how you can come up with a better quality translation.
[Edited at 2016-11-17 22:43 GMT]
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| Comparing my translation with the other translations | Nov 18, 2016 |
What if I make my proper translation of a passage for instance, then I see the other translations. If I consider that a translation is better than mine I choose it. I mean not the whole passage, just a word or a sentence. Is this plagiarism?
Another ethical question comes to my mind. How come that these translators endeavored to make such translations, then a translator comes and uses their translations, which is much easier than starting from scratch ?
| | | | Heinrich Pesch
Finland
Local time: 02:53
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
| This is normal practise | Nov 18, 2016 |
Of course a translator of Hamlet will look carefully at all previous translations in order to improve his/her work and to avoid mistakes and misunderstandings.
| | | | Agneta Pallinder
United Kingdom
Local time: 00:53
Member (2014)
Swedish to English
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| Translation/publication history of the book? | Nov 18, 2016 |
Much would depend on the status of those previous translations - have they already been published? If so, when? Are we talking about a book that is a classic, already known in translations that perhaps now seem oldfashioned? An immediate example is that of Marcel Proust's A la recherche... in many different English translations, sometimes a translation that was explicitly just a revision of an earlier translation.
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Clearly your first step should be to clarify the skopos, the purpose of your translation. To do so, you need to find answers (ask the customer and examine the other three translations) to the following:
- Who are the readers of your translation?
- What does the publisher feel will be the expectations of these readers (i.e. what is needed to make them buy the book in masses)?
- What does the publisher expect from you in a translation in general (a more foreignizing transl... See more Clearly your first step should be to clarify the skopos, the purpose of your translation. To do so, you need to find answers (ask the customer and examine the other three translations) to the following:
- Who are the readers of your translation?
- What does the publisher feel will be the expectations of these readers (i.e. what is needed to make them buy the book in masses)?
- What does the publisher expect from you in a translation in general (a more foreignizing translation that is closer to the source text, or the opposite with a domesticated translation)?
- Are the other three translations outdated, or incompatible with the new skopos?
The customer did not supply sufficient information when they asked you to "improve on the other three translations". Furthermore, those translations could be obsolete (no longer agreeable/acceptable to the current target audience), or they might lead you astray and out of the current skopos.
[Edited at 2016-11-18 13:10 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 00:53
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
| More questions | Nov 18, 2016 |
Tomás Cano Binder, CT wrote:
Clearly your first step should be to clarify the skopos, the purpose of your translation. To do so, you need to find answers (ask the customer and examine the other three translations) to the following:
- Who are the readers of your translation?
- What does the publisher feel will be the expectations of these readers (i.e. what is needed to make them buy the book in masses)?
- What does the publisher expect from you in a translation in general (a more foreignizing translation that is closer to the source text, or the opposite with a domesticated translation)?
- Are the other three translations outdated, or incompatible with the new skopos?
The customer did not supply sufficient information when they asked you to "improve on the other three translations". Furthermore, those translations could be obsolete (no longer agreeable/acceptable to the current target audience), or they might lead you astray and out of the current skopos.
In short, I'd want to ask "Why is another translation needed to the extent that you (the client) are ready to pay for it?"
If he can't seem to give a clear reason then I'd wonder why not.
Another question I'd consider asking is "Are you prepared to pay more than my normal per-word translation rate for this job?"
You seem to be suggesting, OP (forgive me if I'm wrong), that he thinks provision of the other translations will mean less work for you, and therefore less cost for him. That isn't going to happen - or at least, the less work part isn't going to happen! You're going to have to read four books here: the source one plus three translations! Okay, you may be able to skim through the translations, but it will still take time. And then you're going to be skipping from one to another while you're translating, which will seriously affect your concentration.
If those translations aren't freely available, I'd suspect plagiarism in some form or another. I often work as a monolingual English editor so I know there's a lot of (illegal) demand for "changing this and that to make it read differently". But of course if he's willing to pay for a full translation then that's less likely to be an issue, as a new translation is perfectly legal. I don't see how getting inspiration for the odd word or phrase from earlier translations can be a problem.
| | | | | Rewording, rewriting?? | Nov 18, 2016 |
The book I was asked to translate belongs to an author of the 18th century. So as regards copyright there is no problem since it’s in the public domain. The problem is with the translations of this book which are all recent (no more than 15 years). These translations are all published. Moreover, the editor does not pay me in the same way when he gives me other translations as it is for him just a kind of reformulation. For instance if I translate a book from scratch, without the help of any tr... See more The book I was asked to translate belongs to an author of the 18th century. So as regards copyright there is no problem since it’s in the public domain. The problem is with the translations of this book which are all recent (no more than 15 years). These translations are all published. Moreover, the editor does not pay me in the same way when he gives me other translations as it is for him just a kind of reformulation. For instance if I translate a book from scratch, without the help of any translation, he gives me 0.10 $, a word and if he gives me other translations I’m paid 0.07 $ a word. What do you think?
[Modifié le 2016-11-19 10:47 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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An "editor" asked you? Not the author? Is the "editor" with the publishing company that is going to publish a new translation? Did they offer you advance payment?
I am asking these questions because some of the circumstances you described would make me very suspicious of the entire deal.
Please make sure that this project is in fact a legitimate request, and not another advance payment scam.
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| Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member because it was not in line with site rule | DZiW (X)
Ukraine
English to Russian
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| if A>B and B>C | Nov 18, 2016 |
If it's a legit offer, then similarly to meta-analysis (which combines the results of multiple authors), in this meta-translation one should check the (1) original, (2) personal translation, edit (3) variant #1, (4) variant #2, and (5) variant #3, including possible meta-improvements and unifying the style and the lexicon, and so on... a sizeable transaction.
Ahem, do they realize the work content, the time required, and the cash involved?
On the other hand, it seems more inte... See more If it's a legit offer, then similarly to meta-analysis (which combines the results of multiple authors), in this meta-translation one should check the (1) original, (2) personal translation, edit (3) variant #1, (4) variant #2, and (5) variant #3, including possible meta-improvements and unifying the style and the lexicon, and so on... a sizeable transaction.
Ahem, do they realize the work content, the time required, and the cash involved?
On the other hand, it seems more interesting and I would certainly align the provided translations to make a better use of CAT ▲ Collapse
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mekman99 wrote:
The book I was asked to translate belongs to an author of the 18th century. So as regards copyright there is no problem since it’s in the public domain. The problem is with the translations of this book which are all recent (no more than 15 years). These translations are all published. Moreover, the editor do not pay me in the same way when he gives me other translations as it is for him just a kind of reformulation. For instance if I translate a book from scratch, without the help of any translation, he gives me 0.10 $, a word and if he gives me other translations I’m paid 0.07 $ a word. What do you think?
You say copyright is not a problem, and yet as that article I mentioned above states:
"Subject to contract and regardless of contract, you will be the first owner of copyright. You may then give that copyright away, but you are still the owner of the copyright in the translation.
Consequently, there is a layering of copyright. There is the copyright in the original language and there is then a copyright in the translation. The latter is often called a dependent copyright because it is dependent on another copyright for its existence.
As an example, Proust who died in 1922 is out of copyright in the UK (he may still be in copyright in France due to different rules) but the Scott Moncrieff translations of the works of Proust and their adaptations by later translators remain in copyright.
So, in terms of layered rights, there is a first copyright with the original work. There is then a second copyright, which is dependent on the original work. And the person who makes the revision of the works will also have a copyright.
There is another curious issue. If you are translating from Norwegian into English and then someone uses your translation to translate from English into French, you as the translator into English are entitled to charge a fee for the translation of your English translation into French. This is because – as long as you have not given that right away – somebody is layering another copyright on your copyright."
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